DYS Numbers  
Kit # A                                                     Y Y               H
N                                                     G C C               A
C                                                     A A A               P
E                   3   3                             T             C C     L
S         3 3       8   8   4 4             4 4 4 4   A I I         D D     O
T 3 3   3 8 8 4 3 4 9 3 9 4 5 5 4 4 4 4 4 4 6 6 6 6 4 I I 4 6 5 5 Y Y 4 4 G
O 9 9 1 9 5 5 2 8 3 | 9 | 5 9 9 5 5 4 3 4 4 4 4 4 4 6 H     5 0 7 7   4 3 R
R 3 0 9 1 a b 6 8 9 1 2 2 8 a b 5 4 7 7 8 9 a b c d 0 4 a b 6 7 6 0 a b 2 8 P
  Group 1
4656 Joseph Payne b. 1724-25, d. 1803 Bedford Co, VA > James Payne b. 1760 13 25 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 9 13 25 17 9 10 11 11 26 15 19 26 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 23 16 15 18 17 38 39 12 12 R1b1
25636 Joseph Payne b. 1724-25, d. 1803 Bedford Co, VA > Barnett Payne b. 1770 13 25 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 9 13 25 18 9 10 11 11 26 15 19 27 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 23 16 15 18 17 39 40 12 12 R1b1
29502 Joseph Payne b. 1724-25, d. 1803 Bedford Co, VA > Obediah Payne b. 1756 13 25 14 12 11 14 12 12 12 9 13 25 17 9 10 11 11 26 15 19 27 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 23 16 15 18 17 38 40 12 12 R1b1

The DYS Numbers in red have shown a faster mutation rate than the average, and therefore these markers are very helpful at splitting lineages into subsets, or branches, within a family tree. DYS 19 is also known as DYS 394. A Single Nucleotide Polymorphism (SNP) test, which is used to confirm the haplogroup, has been performed on the haplogroups written in bold, red print in the right hand column. It is necessary to do an SNP (commonly called “snip”) test for only one individual within a family group in order to determine the haplogroup for everyone in the group.

Copyright © December 2003, Revised 2006, 2008, 2009
Mary Fern Souder

My Payne family spent a lot of time in the courthouse! Our earliest known ancestors are Joseph Payne, born between 1720-1730, and his wife, Phebe, of Bedford County, VA. Joseph and Phebe had eleven children, and there is a prodigious paper trail leading from Joseph and Phebe down to my last Payne ancestor, William B. Payne, born in 1813 in Kentucky.

Joseph was about 51 years of age when the Revolutionary War broke out. The earliest record we have for him is dated 4 January 1796 when he received reparations for his contribution to the Revolutionary War effort. An account of his donation and his remuneration is recorded in triplicate in Bedford County, VA:

One such document is a receipt dated 4 January 1781 and certified by John Ward that he had "received of Joseph Payne two beef cattle that weighed 400 pounds for which payment at the rate of 24 Shillings per pound shall be made." This receipt is recorded in Abercrombie & Slatten's "Virginia Revolutionary Public Claims," Vol. 1, p. 103, 116. (Because of the low weight of the cattle, it is assumed that Joseph had slaughtered and dressed these animals).

Another is "Joseph Payne proved that he furnished the Commonwealth with 400 pounds of beef for which he is allotted 400 acres of land". Bedford County, VA, Court Order Book 6, p. 346. (Date not obtained)

Also, "Pursuant to an order of Bedford Court to us directed we have processioned the lands lying south of Pate's Road within the bounds of John Pate's Company of militia as followeth: Jan. 4, 1796 - For Joseph Payne himself and James Payne present 415 acres." Bedford County, VA, Processioners Book, 1796-1812.

In many cases, when the War was over the federal government had no money to reimburse their claimants with cash, so they substituted land in lieu of cash. In the above documents there seems to be a discrepancy as to whether Joseph received both money and land, and whether his land grant was 400 or 415 acres.

Joseph's will, written on 27 June 1803 and proved on 24 September 1803, was contested by several of his eleven children, overturned, and subsequently reinstated. The subject of the dispute over his will was that he apparently had a deathbed change of heart and willed all of his property to one son, James Payne, rather than the equal distribution to all of his children as he had previously mentioned. Joseph's other children were Thomas Payne, Joseph Payne, John Payne, Obadiah Payne, Barnett Payne, Lucy Stanley, Betsey Crabtree, Susannah Slinker, Nancy Brown, and Dicey Brown, and all received one dollar apiece.

The summary that is presented below will be lengthy and rather detailed because the relationships in this Payne family were extraordinarily complicated. Much speculation and misinformation has been reported during the past several decades about the Joseph Payne lineage, some of which has been posted online. This summary will combine traditional genealogical research as well as DNA evidence to clarify paternal relationships in our Payne family.

There were at least three Payne families who lived simultaneously in the mid-1700's in Spotsylvania and Bedford Counties, VA, whom many researchers have assumed would share a common patrilineal Payne ancestor. These families were headed by Joseph Payne, Barnett Payne, Sr., and Flayle Payne. With the advent of DNA testing this theory could be validated or refuted, and DNA evidence has shown that these three families have separate and disparate Y-chromosome signatures, and thus do not share an unbroken paternal Payne lineage from a common male Payne ancestor.

The Joseph Payne DNA Study is fortunate to have participants who descend from three proven sons of Joseph and Phebe Payne: James Payne, Barnett Payne, and Obediah Payne. A brief descendency chart for the three participants will be presented before the more detailed discussion of each lineage:

Participant 4656: Joseph Payne b. ca. 1724, d. 1803 Bedford Co, VA + Phebe > James Payne b. 1768, d. 1842 Bedford Co, VA + (unknown partner) > Jubal Payne b. 1787 VA, d. 1850 Barren County, KY + Rhoda Basham > Dudley Payne b. 21 October 1809 VA, d. aft. 1865 Barren County, KY + Martha Bewley.

Participant 35636: Joseph Payne b. 1720-30, d. 1803 Bedford Co, VA + Phebe > Barnett Payne b. ca. 1770 + (partner Jane Martin) > Christopher Payne b. 1805 +2 Virginia Nichols, to Fayette Co, W. VA in 1843.

Participant 29502: Joseph Payne b. 1720-30, d. 1803 Bedford Co, VA + Phebe > Obediah Payne b. 1752, d. 1818 Knox Co, KY + Jemima Oney > Joseph E. Payne b. 1777 Knox Co, KY, d. 1857 Knox Co, KY +1 Mary Stewart > William H. Payne b. 1814 Knox Co, KY, relocated to Boone County, KY & changed surname to Stewart), d. ca. 1870 + Sarah A. Haskins.

Participant 4656:

Generation 1: James Payne, the son of Joseph and Phebe Payne mentioned above who received all of his father's estate, was born ca. 1768, and died ca. 1842 in Bedford County, VA. In 1787 James fathered a son, Jubal Payne, by an unknown partner. Jubal was born 8 December 1787, and had a sister, Nancy Payne, born ca. 1789, who married Robert Harrison. The mother of neither child is known, but Nancy told her children that she was not raised by her parents and knew that Jubal Payne was her brother. Further, Nancy claimed that her mother was a Chaffin, and her mother's mother was a Canute. When Jubal Payne married Rhoda Basham on 20 August 1808 in Franklin County, VA, Robert Harrison, Nancy's husband, served as the bondsman for Jubal, while Rhoda's father, William Basham, Jr., was the other bondsman.

Eleven years after the birth of Jubal, a deed shows that James had a wife named Anny (or Amy). In 1798 he and Anny, along with William Brown and wife Elizabeth, sold 150 acres they jointly owned to Charles Anthony (as per Bedford County Deed Book K, page 181). Since neither William nor Elizabeth Brown was a sibling of James Payne, perhaps Anny was a sister of William or Elizabeth Brown and the siblings were selling their inheritance. James had one additional child who may have belonged to either his unknown partner or to his wife, Anny. This was William Payne, born before 1792.

James Payne married Sarah "Sally" Anderson who was some 20 years his junior, on 29 November 1802 in Bedford County, VA. Although some researchers have assigned Anny as the mother of several of James Payne's children, I believe the evidence suggests that Jubal and Nancy may have been full siblings whose mother was James' partner, and that William (born before 1792) could have been the son of Anny (or the unknown partner). The remaining nine children belonged to Sarah Anderson.

On the 1820 census for Bedford County, VA, James Payne is listed with his wife. He was over age 45 and Sarah was age 26-45. They had four sons under the age of 16 and five daughters under the age of 16 (thus all belonging to Sarah), and one daughter age 16-26, who could have been born after James' 1802 marriage to Sarah.

Some Payne researchers have attributed two additional women, Elizabeth Payne who married Peter Moore in 1823 and Phoebe A. Payne who married Richard Ferguson in 1826, as daughters of James Payne. These women were not mentioned in James Payne's will. Although Elizabeth predeceased James, so did James' deceased son, William Payne, who was mentioned in the will. Elizabeth and Phoebe had moved to Cass County, IN, and sometimes children were omitted if they had left the vicinity. However, Jubal Payne and Nancy Payne Harrison were living in Kentucky at the time their father wrote his will, and this did not prevent them from being mentioned in the will. Therefore, I believe that Elizabeth and Phoebe A. Payne were nieces of James Payne, perhaps the daughters of one of his deceased brothers.

James wrote his will on 31 December 1841, and mentioned his wife Sally and 12 children: Sally could live on his estate "for her lifetime, along with her unmarried children including Jane Richardson and her children as long as she continues separated from her husband Washington Richardson. . . because of his ill treatment of her. . . and after Sally's death James bequeathed the whole balance of his estate real and personal to daughters Jane, Lucinda, Louisa, Margaret and Lucy. . . but if Jane should go back to her husband she shall forfeit her interest in his estate and it shall be equally divided among Lucinda, Louisa, Margaret and Lucy."

James Payne's will then makes a vertical list of the following seven children:

"Jubal Payne-an illegitimate son who is well off and needs no assistance.

Nancy Harrison who intermarried with Robert Harrison I have done for her all I am able to do in justice to younger children.

William Payne-deceased. I have done as much for him in his life time and for his children as I am able to do, and in fact they were for a considerable time a heavy charge on me.

James Payne-I have done all for him I am able to do.

Joseph Payne-I have also done as far as I am able to do.

John Payne-I have also done as much for him as I am able to do.

and my youngest son Braddock Payne has already cost me more than I am able to give the rest of my children and therefore cannot reconcile it to any consciences to give him anything more."

Generation 2: Jubal and Rhoda Basham married in 1808 in Franklin County, VA, and in about 1812 Jubal and Rhoda moved to Breckenridge County, KY, along with Rhoda's parents and other family members. By 1830 Jubal and Rhoda had moved to Barren County, KY, and lived near Robert and Nancy Payne Harrison, who had previously moved to Barren County. Jubal lived in Barren County until his death in 1850, and Nancy Payne Harrison lived there until 1888, dying at about age 98.

Some researchers have postulated that a younger Jubal Payne, born ca. 1814, who lived next to James Payne on the 1840 census in Bedford County, VA, is the same man named as James Payne's illegitimate son. Several factors discount this theory:

Since this younger Jubal Payne was only about age 27 when James wrote his will, it seems unlikely that he could be described as "well off and needs no assistance." The lifelong "closeness" of Jubal Payne born 1797 to proven daughter Nancy Payne Harrison born 1799, the fact that Nancy was not reared by her parents, Nancy's husband was the bondsman for the marriage of Jubal and Rhoda Payne, and on the vertical list of heirs Jubal and Nancy are mentioned first in a seemingly descending birth order, all indicate that the elder Jubal (husband of Rhoda Basham) was the illegitimate son of James Payne.

It seems possible that the younger Jubal Payne, born ca. 1814, was the grandson of James Payne, born ca. 1765-1770. James' will mentions that he has helped the children of deceased son William Payne and "that they were for a considerable time a heavy charge on me." On the 1820 census for Bedford County, VA, William Payne lived in the vicinity of James Payne, and William had three sons and two daughters under the age of ten. The female in the home was over 45 (so was not the mother of the five children and was perhaps William's mother-in-law or other relative who was caring for the children). This young Jubal Payne, born ca. 1814, was the age to be the son of William Payne and explains young Jubal's close proximity to James Payne in 1840.

Generation 3: An extant Bible record lists the 16 children that were born to Jubal and Rhoda Payne. Their children were Dudley, Richard Haden, William B., Nancy, Margaret, James, Agnes, Simeon, Eliza Jane, Jubal, Joel (twin), Mary D. (twin), Sely, Martha Ann, Barnet, and John W. Payne. I had hoped to locate a participant who descends from my ancestor, William B. Payne, born 1813, but his male descendents went to Dallas County, TX, and the heavy population of Dallas County and the large number of Paynes currently living there hampered the search. Participant 4656 descends from Jubal and Rhoda Payne's oldest son, Dudley Payne, born 1809, who married Martha Bewley.

Participant 25635: Barnett Payne, son of Joseph and Phebe Payne, was born between 1770-1775. He was well off for that day and time and owned a considerable amount of property on the Staunton River in both Bedford and Franklin Counties VA. Deed records show that he bought 510 acres at various times between 1796 and 1835. He was a slaveholder and lent out three of his slaves to accompany Jubal and Rhoda Basham Payne on their rigorous journey from Franklin County, VA, to Breckenridge County, KY. In 1813, Barnett went to Breckenridge County and brought the slaves back to Virginia.

The 1820 Bedford County, VA, census shows Barnett as head of a large household. Barnet was over age 45, and the oldest female was age 26-45. They had eleven younger persons in their home, plus three slaves. Five persons were engaged in agriculture, two in commerce, and one in manufacturing. Seven of these persons were children under the age of 16. It is assumed that the oldest female was Jane "Jinny" Martin.

Barnet Payne was indicted in Franklin County, VA, for the act of fornication with Jinny Martin. Common Law Order Book 6, dated 1810-1823, gives an account of the charges on pages 210, 216, 239, and 255. (Fornication is consensual sex between two unmarried persons). Three members of the Grand Jury, Joel Early, Edward Carroway, and Patrick Hill, sent William McCormack to investigate, and upon his report summoned Barnett Payne and Jinnie Martin to appear in Court.

On 21 July 1819, Barnett posted bond of $150.00 for his intended marriage to Jane Martin. Page 267 of Book 6 states that "the attorney for the Commonwealth by Leave of the Court saith that he will not further prosecute . . . it was considered by the Court that the rule aforesaid be discharged." There is no record that the marriage was ever performed, and Barnett and Jane lived independently at least part of the time. In later documents Jane is listed as both Jane Martin and Jenny Payne.

On the 1840 census, Barnett Payne was enumerated in Franklin County as Bernard Pain, age 60-70. He had one female age 20-30 in his home, and one female under age five. Jenny Payne was enumerated in 1840 as head of household in Bedford County, with five younger persons in the home.

Barnett Payne wrote his will on 15 September 1842, and it was proved on 1 September 1845 in Franklin County, VA. "First, I give to Jane Martin in Bedford County the privilege to live on my tract of land she now lives on and to cultivate it for the use of herself and her children together with the sugartree bottom. . . and after her death the said tract of land and sugartree bottom I give and bequeath to Temperance and Elvira Payne my daughters I had by Jane Martin to be equally divided, by their first paying to Elizabeth Drake and Jane Tucker formerly Elizabeth Payne and Jane Payne the sum of $150.00 each . . . I give to the heirs of Julia Ann Sparks the tract I now live on in Franklin County. . . and after the death of Julia Ann Sparks to be divided among the heirs of her body after first paying Elizabeth Drake and Jane Tucker $50.00 each. I give to Sarah Jane Sparks the tract of land in Bedford County known as Robertson tract. I give to Joseph M. Payne, Thomas Payne, Christopher Payne, and Dudley Payne my tract of land in Franklin County known by the name of Soft Grub Hill to be divided equally . . . anything that is left after debts and funeral expenses are paid I give to Sarah Jane Sparks and if she dies it is to go to her mother Julia Ann Sparks." Benjamin Meador was named Executioner. Witnesses were Joseph A. Meador, Elizah McGuire, and Thomas J. (illegible).

Jane Payne, age 65, was enumerated on the 1850 Bedford County census with her single daughters, Temperance Payne, age 40, and Elvira Payne, age 35. Also in the home were William Wattley, age 18, laborer, and Joseph Payne, age 10, who was Elvira's natural son.

The nine children of Barnett Payne listed in his will were Temperance Payne, Elvira Payne, Elizabeth Drake, Jane Tucker, Julia Ann Sparks, Joseph M. Payne, Thomas Payne, Christopher Payne, and Dudley Payne. Because Barnett Payne made special mention that Temperance and Elvira Payne were daughters he had with Jane Martin, this suggests that at least some of the other children may have had a different mother. Also, notice that Henry and John Payne, whom some attribute as sons of Barnett Payne, are not mentioned in this will.

However, on 2 January 1853 Jane Martin wrote her will, naming eleven children, and it was proved on 23 July 1853. She mentioned the following children: Henry, John, Joseph, Thomas, Christopher, Dudley, Temperance, and Elvira Payne, Elizabeth Drake, Jane Tucker, and Julia Ann Sparks. Since Jane's will mentioned all of the children listed in Barnett's will, plus Henry and John Payne, perhaps Henry and John did belong to Barnett, and he either chose to omit them or they were inadvertently left out of his will. Jane left her personal Negro woman to Julia Ann Sparks, and her remaining slaves were to be divided equally among all her children. However, if they could not be divided equally, then they were to be lent out until enough money had been accrued so that they could be divided equally. *Note: At least eight children of Barnett and Jane's were born before 1819 when Barnett posted bond for his intended marriage to Jane Martin.

Generation 2: Participant 25635 descends from Christopher Payne, born 1805, and his second wife, Virginia Nichols. Christopher and Virginia moved to Fayette County, WVA in 1843.

Participant 29502:

Generation 1: Obediah Payne, born ca. 1752, was the son of Joseph and Phebe Payne. In 1773, he was one of the first settlers of the Deskins Valley area of Tazwell County, VA, as listed in William C. Pendleton's, "History of Tazewell County and Southwest Virginia 1748-1920," page 234. He went there with Richard Oney, who was then, or soon to be, his brother-in-law. Obediah married Jemima Oney daughter of Benjamin Oney. The date of Obediah's birth is calculated to be ca. 1752, since he was mentioned as a settler in 1773.

On 2 November 1781, an entry was made in Land Entry Book 1, page 53, for 150 acres on the Clinch River, Tazwell County, VA, for Obediah Payne. This was part of Treasury Warrant # 7844, and is mentioned in Benjamin Oney's will in Tazwell County, VA.

During the first several years of Obediah's adult life, he frequently spent time in jail. In 1780 in Bedford County he was remanded to the public goal in the city of Richmond. In 1786 Obediah Payne of Bedford County, late of Montgomery County, was committed to the jail of this county. In 1788 in Montgomery County he was put into jail for suspicion of taking a black horse, killing of hogs, and stealing a bay horse.

In the Determined Papers of 1785-1786 in Bedford County, VA, Obediah confessed to the following: Sometime in 1775 while he was living with Richard Wilson in Botetourt County, VA, Wilson had persuaded him to withhold two eight £ bills of silk paper money from William Campbell, and to give it to Wilson. After a small time Obediah wanted to return it to Campbell, but Wilson promised he would do it in his behalf and said that if he returned the money he would be hanged; then Wilson converted the money to his own use. Additional charges to which Obediah confessed were that he had taken a horse from his brother, Joseph Payne, and sold it to Samuel Crockett; had feloniously taken a mare from Charles Anderson of Bedford County; borrowed a horse from Samuel Crockett; and borrowed a coat from one of his own sons. Obediah had traded Anderson's mare and Crockett's horse to Thomas Flowers of Botetourt County.

In 1790 in Russell County, VA, Book 1, page 191, it was reported that Obediah was tried by a Grand Jury, found guilty, and sentenced to 15 lashes well laid on his bare back, he being convicted of carrying away a fox skin worth 15 shillings.

On 14 May 1795 in Russell County, VA, Book 2, page 209, in Call Court records, Obediah was indicted on suspicion of a felony and the murder of a French settler, Monsieur Pierre Francois deTubeuff. According to an account published in the "Republican Journal and Dumfries Advertiser," June 12, 1795, in the last of April twelve conspirators had approached the home of deTubeuff, and one feigned illness. The gentleman deTubeuff welcomed all of the men inside and when his back was turned, one of the men beat out his brains with the butt of his gun. The conspirators then robbed the home of items worth $1,000. DeTubeuff's son and a housekeeper were injured, and a servant attempting to escape drowned in the Clinch River. Three men were caught, including "the noted Obediah Payne," and taken into custody. One of the other men admitted to the murder, Obediah declared himself not guilty, and the three were bound over until the next court date. Obediah was later acquitted.

It is believed that Obediah Payne left the Russell County, VA, area about 1797, and went to Knox County, KY. He was definitely in Knox County in 1800 as he received a bounty for a wolf scalp sold there. Obediah seems to have left his past behind and turned over a new leaf upon moving to Kentucky, because records there show no further arrests, and that he served as a juror in Knox County. Obediah left no will when he died in 1818. His descendents report that he is buried in the Martin Cemetery on the Old Payne Martin Place, Bimble Hinkle Road in Knox County, KY. Only an unmarked stone marks his burial place. His wife Jemima died about 1820 and is also buried there. Descendents of Obediah report that his known children were Elijah, Elisha, Thomas, Joseph, William, and Benjamin Oney Payne.

Generation 2: Participant 29502 descends from Obediah and Jemima's son, Joseph E. Payne, who married first Mary "Polly" Stewart on 1 April 1801 in Knox County, KY. Joseph E. Payne left a will dated 1866 in Knox County, KY. His will named twelve children: William, Joseph, Joel, Franklin, Nancy, Rachel, Eliza, Agnes, Joann, Lucy, Letitha, and Lydia Payne.

Generation 3: William H. Payne, son of Joseph E. and Mary Stewart Payne, was born ca. 1814. Elderly descendents have reported to present-day family members that William "got into trouble" in Knox County, KY, so he relocated to Boone County, KY, where he changed his surname to "Stewart," which was his mother's maiden name. William H. Stewart married Sarah Ann Hoskins on 28 September 1834 in Harlan County, KY. All descendents of William H. Payne carry the Stewart surname.

Analysis of Payne DNA Results:

The Y-chromosome results of the participants shown at the top of this analysis chart clearly corroborate the paper trails from three of Joseph and Phebe Payne's sons, James, Barnett, and Obediah Payne. These results show that there has been one mutation in the family of each son on the 25-marker Y-chromosome test: the James Payne line mutated from a 27 to a 26 on DYS 449; the Barnett Payne line mutated from a 17 to an 18 on DYS 458; and the Obediah Payne line mutated from an 11 to a 12 on DYS 391.

It was hoped that the Y-chromosome signature of Joseph Payne would match that of Flayle Payne, who was a contemporary of Joseph and Phebe Payne in Bedford County, VA. In fact, in 1845 in Bedford County, one Thomas Payne, aged 78 years (born ca. 1767), gave a deposition supporting the claim that Patrick Lynch had served in the Revolutionary War. Thomas Payne swore that he and his father (not named) had come to Bedford County, VA, in 1773 "(from Frederick County, MD)," and that Fraly (sic) Payne "(the deponent's uncle)," had come to Bedford County in 1779, "settling within a mile of the deponent's residence."

Since Joseph and Phebe Payne had a son named Thomas Payne (born ca. 1755), and the deponent's name was also Thomas Payne (born ca. 1767), it was assumed that Joseph and Phebe were undoubtedly somehow related to the family of Flayle Payne. However, with DNA testing it became immediately obvious that Joseph Payne and Flayle Payne did not share a paternal Payne ancestor. Patrick Payne began a comprehensive Payne Y-chromosome study, and the results of all Paynes who have joined the study as of 2007 are posted here: Patrick Payne DNA Chart. The participants who represent Joseph and Phebe can be seen under Lineage 10, while the results of Flayle's descendents are presented in Lineage 6.

Perhaps the most common misattribution for the ancestry of Joseph Payne is based on the fact that Joseph and Phebe named a son "Barnett Payne," and they also had several grandsons named Barnett. Further, Joseph and Phebe Payne lived near and interacted with the children of Barnett Payne, Sr. This misattribution has resulted in many Trees on the Internet which report that Joseph
Payne was the grandson of Barnett Payne, Sr., though some unknown son, perhaps Barnett Payne, Jr.

Barnett Pain/Payne, Sr., was born ca. 1665. He and his wife Elizabeth lived in Middlesex County, VA, then King and Queen County, VA, and finally settled in Spotsylvania County, VA. Many credible Payne researchers have done extensive research into Joseph and Phebe's family, and they have never been able to locate any documentary evidence that proves the names of Joseph Payne's parents. Those who carefully studied the family of Joseph Payne had estimated his date of birth as between 1720-1730, based on the ages of his adult children at the time of his death.

A will for Barnett Payne, Sr., has not been located, but John Charles Payne's "The Big Payne Book," privately published in 2007, attributed five children to him: Anne, Barnett, Jr., William, John, and Mary Pain/Payne. All evidence for these children is circumstantial, with the strongest case being that Barnett Payne, Sr., was the father of Barnett Payne, Jr. "The Big Payne Book," deals primarily with John Paine/Payne, and gives a very scholarly account of his life and his children. Following is a brief list of the proposed children of Barnett Payne, Sr:

Anne, daughter of "Barnard" Paine was born 22 September 1693 and baptized in Christ Church Parish in Middlesex County, VA.

Barnett Payne, Jr., predeceased his father in Spotsylvania County, VA, and Barnett, Sr. was the administrator of his son's estate. The brief court record lists none of the particulars for Barnett, Jr.'s estate. However, we do know that Barnett Payne, Jr., was married to Anne Askew, daughter of John Askew and Jane Pigg of Spotsylvania County, VA. Barnett, Jr., witnessed a deed for Edward Pigg (Jane's father), in 1738 in Spotsylvania County.

William Paine witnessed a deed in Spotsylvania County, VA, on 24 November 1738 from Edward Pigg and Abraham Rogers to William Hawkins. Given the relationship of Barnett Paine (Jr.) to Edward Pigg (who was the grandfather of Barnett Jr.'s wife) it seems plausible that William Paine was a son of Barnett Payne, Sr.

John Paine, born ca. 1705 in King and Queen County, VA, died ca. 1770 in Spotsylvania County, VA. The basis of placing John Payne as the son of Barnett Payne, Sr., is that the names of John Payne and Barnett Payne (Jr.) appear together on a petition to build a road in 1725. John Paine/Payne made his will in Spotsylvania County in 1764, and it was proved in 1770. The will listed six sons by name (John, Thomas, Barnett, William, Robert, and George Payne), and mentioned "daughters," but did not list a son named Joseph. Two men in the Payne DNA Study descend from this John Paine, through two different sons.

Mary Paine, born ca. 1710 in King and Queen County, VA, married Lawrence Franklin and died ca. 1791 in Anson County, NC.

When the results of DNA testing began to be reported, and participants were notified of those who matched them, it became obvious that the descendents of Joseph and Phebe Payne did not match the participants who descend from two different sons of John Paine/Payne, b. 1705 (assumed son of Barnett Payne, Sr.). The results of descendents of these two brothers are presented as Lineage 5 in Patrick Payne's DNA chart (mentioned above). Therefore, if John Paine/Payne was the brother of Barnett Paine/Payne, Jr., and both were sons of Barnett Paine/Payne, Sr., then Joseph who married Phebe, could not be the grandson of Barnett Paine/Payne, Sr., through one of his sons.

A note of interest is that Family Tree DNA made a special call to inform us that the score of 9 for Joseph Payne's descendent on DYS # 389-1 is extremely rare! At the time Payne Participant 4656 tested (in 2002), that result on DYS # 389-1 had never been seen before by FTDNA. A communication in February 2008 reported that only 0.03 percent of all participants in the Family Tree DNA database carry a score of 9 on DYS # 389-1 and almost all were for a Payne or a Warren.

As the number of persons who have taken the Y-chromosome test has rapidly increased, it is noteworthy to see that the Joseph Payne participants do not match any other Paynes, but do match a group of Warren participants of Spotsylvania County, VA. These Warren participants descend from the family of John R. Warren, born ca. 1635, who was married to Rachel Williams. In fact, as of February 2008 there were 118,000 Y-chromosome results in the FTDNA database, and the only matches for the Joseph Payne descendents were with this Warren family. By July 2009, fourteen descendents of John R. Warren had tested, and one Payne descendent perfectly matched all 37 of the 37 markers tested (referred to as a 37/37 match) with one Warren participant. The Paynes matched four other Warrens on 36/37 markers. Matches of this degree between two different surnames who lived simultaneously and very close to each other in the same county are a very strong indicator that these two families shared the same ancestor.

The Warren family has enjoyed many decades of devoted research by historian Wilma Warren Raysin. Wilma previously published the "Warren Clearinghouse-Depository & Exchange." The Warren DNA and Payne DNA Projects became aware that the descendents of Joseph Payne and John R. Warren, both of Spotsylvania County, VA, matched each other (and only each other), and Wilma was called upon to give an opinion of how this might have happened.

Wilma W. Raysin suggested that a clue to tying the Warrens and Paynes together could be the Askew family. Among the children of John R. and Rachel Warren was a son named Thomas Warren, b. 1 January 1683, who married Mary Hackley. Their daughter, Rachel Warren had married John Askew (Jr.), son of John Askew and Jane Pigg. Barnett Payne, Jr., married Anne Askew, a daughter of John Askew and Jane Pigg.

An examination of the document used by the alleged Barnett Payne Sr., descendents to support their claim that John Paine/Payne was the son of Barnett Paine/Payne, Sr., shows that the Pain/Paine/Payne family lived very close to Thomas Warren (father of Rachel Warren who married John Askew (Jr.). A transcription of this document follows:

On 4 May 1725 Henry Goodloe and Harry Beverley petitioned the county court to have a road cleared from their homes to the church on the Ta River. The court ordered that "the road according as it is marked & laid out & go through the lands of Barnett Pain and Edward Pigg to the most convenient way to Col. John Robinson's rolling road, be the road, and that Lawrence Franklin be Surveyor of the same, and that the male tithables of Henry Goodloe, Gent., Mark Wheeler, George Pemberton, Samuel Hamm, Mr. William Stannard's Quarter, Thomas Warren, John Askew, William Rice, Barnett Pane, Mr. Nathaniel Sander's Quarter & John Pain's plantations do help him clear the same." Spotsylvania County Virginia Minute Book 1724-1730, page 44.

Following is a very significant piece of the puzzle, which explains how Joseph Payne's descendents could match the Y-chromosome signatures of those of John R. Warren and his son, Thomas Warren:

On 3 December 1724 the Grand Jury of Spotsylvania County charged two couples, Henry Rogers and Elizabeth Fulshure and Thomas Warren and Susanna Pain with living in adultery. [Adultery is defined as consensual sex when one (or both) of the persons is married. Thomas Warren, Sr., was born 1 January 1683 and was married to Mary Hackley. His son, Thomas Warren, Jr., born ca. 1710, was unmarried, as well as too young to have been the man charged with adultery].

It is possible that Susanna Pain is the same person as Anne Pain who was baptized 22 September 1793 in Middlesex County, VA, daughter of Barnard Payne, Sr., and wife Elizabeth. Even if Anne Paine and Susannah Pain are not the same person, but are sisters, the December 1724 charge of adultery between Thomas Warren and Susanna Pain/Payne makes it extremely likely that the reason for DNA matches between Joseph Payne's descendents and fourteen Warrens of Spotsylvania County, VA (as of 2009), was the birth of Joseph Payne to Thomas Warren and Susanna Pain/Payne.

The liaison between Thomas Warren and Susanna Pain explains why Joseph went by the surname of Payne, why he and his sons used the name "Barnett" for their sons, and why his descendents match the Warrens of Spotsylvania County, VA. If Susanna lived with her parents, Joseph was surely reared in the home of Barnett and Elizabeth Payne, and this would explain why Joseph also named his first two daughters Elizabeth, b. ca. 1757, and Susanna, born ca. 1761.

Instead of the approximate date of birth that Payne researchers first estimated for Joseph Payne (between 1720 and 1730), the date of the adultery charge provides a much more specific date of birth for Joseph Payne-probably late 1724 or early 1725.

The official Warren DNA surname project has organized their web site into groups that shared a common ancestor. Our Warrens can be seen here under Rappahannock Warrens: Public Warren DNA.

The results of one Warren Y-chromosome test for a cousin of Mary Fern Souder, along with a commentary of his ancestry, are presented here: Warren DNA Study

Many delightful and helpful researchers have assisted in the study of this large and unconventional extended Payne family, including A. J. Heck, Norman L. Payne, Dale Payne, John Charles Payne, the late Wendall Poynter, John Poynter, Martha Renau Harrison, Melinda Pennington, Cissie Payne, Sandra Claywell, Judi Schuerman, Robert R. Smith, Togin Cassell, Wilma Warren Raysin, Priscilla Warren, Jerald Wilson, Cindy Chotvacs, Sandy Gorin, and Lon York.

There were six transmission events from Joseph Payne to the participant who descends through James Payne. Barnett Payne's descendent reports five transmission events from Joseph Payne to himself, and Obediah Payne's descendent reports eight transmission events from Joseph and himself. One may join the Payne DNA study at: Payne DNA Study

Last Updated on 03/01/08
By Wallace W. Souder